Sri Lanka army's deep penetration unit known as the Long Range Recon Patrol (LRRP) has stepped up its attacks on LTTE targets during the last few weeks. We cannot disclose any detail about the targets taken due to security reasons but we can confirm that several strikes targeting senior LTTE cadres and intelligence wing members were successfully conducted during the last few weeks.
LTTE has dispatched several of it's elite units to hunt down LRRP commando units but they have not had any success so far. Tiger strongholds such as Mullaithivu which are guarded by hard core LTTE fighters have been subject to DPU strikes in the recent past too. Pro LTTE media has come up with false claims about DPU strikes on civilians in the hope to discourage LRRP activity in north.
Meanwhile, Sri Lanka Air Force fighter jets carried out bombing runs targeting several rebel bases in the northern province today. SLAF's MiG and Kfir bombers were used in the attack.
SLAF currently operates 10 Kfir Multirole fighters and 4 MiG 27 'Flogger' ground attack craft in its jet bomber fleet. 3 more MiGg27 jets and one MiG23 trainer craft is set to rejoin 5th jet squadron after an overhauling.
Congratulations are in order to our boys in the LRRP. They are doing a smashing job giving the LTTE leadership a massive headache. I hope they can keep up the pressure on the LTTE in the North. It is my belief that the LRRP is a priceless unit. And to think it was nearly wiped out due to the acts of the previous government.
ReplyDeletehats off to the LRRP groups.
ReplyDeleteTigers must be sleeping with one eye open! ;-)
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ReplyDeleteThanks for this information. However, I strongly suggest that you take extreme caution in giving out the information. These brave soldier's information should be guarded with your LIFE. They are ready to give their lives for our country and it is our responsibility to protect them with our lives. Lives of our soldiers are not expendable like LTTE suicide bombers. All what matters to me is that those bastards get whacked in their own backyard.
ReplyDeleteWell Done LRRP ! take the heat on to fat Oily pig Praba
ReplyDeleteNice work by our own Mahasohonas ! Way to Go !
ReplyDeleteWhat needs to be done is to target the bunker rat. There is no point in continuing to slaughter innocent tamil kids who have been misled by these psychotic barbarians.
ReplyDeleteTake a look at the following Russian website, which features both the SLN and the Sea tigers. Look into the faces of the obviously brave tamil boys and girls who have never been allowed to know any other person of a different race to know the truth about what humanity truly is. It is really no big deal to slaughter them all. But considering the fact that these are people willing to fight what they believe in, it seems worth while to save them.
http://balancer.ru/forum/punbb/viewtopic.php?id=53037&p=1
Tropicalstorm, they maybe brave and they may know no better, but when you pick up a weapon and put on a uniform, you take the consequences. And those brave & ignorant Tamils are killing equally brave GoSL soldiers. Not to mention civilians. War means killing. There's no way around it.
ReplyDeleteyeah i agree with david here. Killing is a part of war, and if brainwashed I guess most people will go along with them. But suicide bombings and massacres and the like are completely and disgustingly inhuman. If you say someone who carried them out attacks like the ones in Aranthalawa or Anuradhapura or Kebethigollawa deserves to live I really disagree. Given a chance, I say every single one of them should be crushed like vermin.
ReplyDeleteAnd will killing prabakran really solve the problem? It will probably make him a martyr to those fags and there will probably be a hundred others to take his place. Not that his dead would be a bad thing, but it would only be part of the solution, the other parts being getting rid of the rest of their top commanders and totally wiping them out in the battlefield.
Even if we wipe them out on the battlefield, it won't solve the problem. Which is an ethnic one. The reason the tamils went to war is because 20 years of peaceful protest against Sinhalese persecution got them nowhere. If you want them to bandon the LTTE, you have to convince them that they don't need Prabha & co. Look at the Palestinians -- they & the Arabs have been defeated in almost every war with the Israelis -- but is the problem sorted?
ReplyDeleteDavid
ReplyDeleteI am in agreement with you upto a point. A rabid dog is a rabid dog.
But, what worries me is the absence of any effort on the part of either the moderate tamil political movements to expand their sphere of influence among the non-tamils by taking developing a greater Sri lankan political agenda than an ethnic one. Today the numbers of Sri Lankan tamis have dwindled to make them the fourth smallest minority behind the tamils of Indian origin and moors. The only democracy would work within Sri lanka in a way that is acceptable to the majority is not thru deviding territory, but by having the political agendas of the parties becoming more amenable to everyone's aspirations. That is the only way the major Tamil parties are going to win any siginificant political victories from where they are now perched.
If the tamils lack the vision, at least far thinking Sinhalese need to assist them realize it. Of course the two major Sinhala parties are not going to do that and create a potential and new political challenger. There needs to be greater intellectual participation to assist in the development of moderate tamil leadership. It is almost too late to allow natural evolution to solve this issue now.The Sinhalese cannot solve the tamils' problems; they are self-inflicted, too numerous to solve and most of them are not interested in solving them in a civilized way anyway. The only way to deal with this issue is to help those we can relate to and live with, to win power with our participation. To make that happen, thier agendas need to be adapted to modern day inclusive realities.
Congratulation, we relly appreciate your dedicated task doing to save Srilanka from LTTE terrorist.
ReplyDeleteI need every LRRP memebers to be well helth. Also I need to everyone encourage to find Light Aircraft and distroy it.
It's good to see the ltte get a taste of their own medecine with the report today abt the claymores going off Near Kili & mannar ! Keep the LRRP modus operandi off the pols in Colombo for Nat Sec sake ! Tnet iz suddenly went dumb about the damage assesment at Katu too !
ReplyDeleteWhat I have suggested has nothing to do with the almost unavoidable military solution viz-a-viz the LTTE. This issue will not end with the military conquest of every single tamil tiger. That is wishful thinking.
ReplyDeleteI am a Sinhales, a patriot and also a realist interested in finding a dignified solution which will teach future generations that there's always a better way than mindless violence. Unfortunately at the present moment a lot of people do not seem to be thinking that far.
What I have suggested has nothing to do with the almost unavoidable military solution viz-a-viz the LTTE. This issue will not end with the military conquest of every single tamil tiger. That is wishful thinking.
ReplyDeleteI am a Sinhales, a patriot and also a realist interested in finding a dignified solution which will teach future generations that there's always a better way than mindless violence. Unfortunately at the present moment a lot of people do not seem to be thinking that far, which is more than likely to lead to a situation where the problem reamins unsolved only to take a new life in a different way.
I don't think anyone believes that the conflict could be ended with a military victory alone. That said, if Tamils are given any form of self-rule today, mark my words, it will be disastrous for the future of Sri Lanka. If you take any similar situation in the past, it always starts with nominal self-rule. A few regional referendums and independence agitations later, you've lost half of your country before you even realize whats happenning.
ReplyDeleteBut look at where the blacks in America. They were suppressed and segregated and discriminated against but did they ever try to carve out a separate state for themselves? Has there ever been even a suggestion of forming a separate country? No. Why? Because even though white folk were / are a lot better off, the lives of blacks are a hundred times better than those of most other peoples in the world.
And that's exactly the situation we have to create here.
A military defeat of the LTTE would be the first step. Afterwards, if we do have lasting peace, strong economic growth like what we've witnessed over the few years would be almost unavoidable. Even for our wonderful politicians it will be difficult to screw up (the last year is a good example).
Will well off Tamils with well paying jobs take up arms against the state in a future time? No chance.
But giving the Tamils some form of self-governance now, as I'm sure you propose, will almost certainly lead to the eventual splitting of the country into two or even three parts.
Jiffy, I think you're quite wrong in your comparison between Israelis/Palestinians and Sinhalese/Tamils. This is off topic, but what makes you see the Israelis as aggressors, but not the Sinhalese? Also, the Israeli government has since independence, demonstrated its ability to govern its own territory reasonably well, unlike the GoSL. If you think governance is about teaching your neighbours not to fuck with you, that's a rather juvenile perspective, and makes the former USSR look like a well-governed nation.
ReplyDeleteTS, IE, the major mistake is to see the military victory (even if possible) as the first step. It cannot be. Military and diplomatic options must be pursued SIMULTANEOUSLY. The LTTE cannot be defeated as long as it has public support; the public cannot be weaned away from the LTTE without a solution to their problems.
Saying that allowing self governance to the Tamils is the first step in dividing the country is ridiculous. There are plenty of constitutional failsafes that can be put in place to prevent this secessation. There's no reason why a two-language federal system aka Canada can't work. Most recently independent countries (Montenegro, East Timor) didn't UDI.
The bottom line is that the Sinhalese will HAVE to share power with the Tamils, and since it's unrealistic to expect a Sinhalese/Tamil sharing of power within a central government (going on history), it has to be within a federal framework.
"that's because the israelis control the ground. they have both the means AND the politcal backing to carry out attacks"
ReplyDeleteAre you saying that the GoSL doesn't control the ground outside the NE? I'm talking about that. I'm talking about the Israeli government providing its citizens with a standard of living far better than we have.
Jiffy, along with Sri Lanka being assertive, it also has to be more responsible and mature. And part of the latter is to stop blaming American, European, and Indian bogeymen for our misfortunes. This war didn't come about becaause of external instigation. It came about by 30 years of majority persecution of the minority.
You talk about subservience of the blacks and Tamils. That's the sort of fuckhead attitude by people like you that spawned a war that people like me had to fight.
You talk about about explaining federalism (not federation btw) to your kids. I'd rather explain that, than have to explain to my kids why they've got to pick up a rifle and go out to die because their parents screwed up and couldn't solve problems in a way that didn't involve sending out young men and women to kill and die. I've always found the people most ready to go to war are the ones who've never been to war.
You talk about the Tamils not being subservient. They were for 30 bloody years while the Sinhalese screwed them (and the other minorities). Then they realised it was time to stop being Gandhi and start fighting back. That attitude to minorities hasn't changed -- and I remember that every time I'm forced to listen to a Buddhist priest chanting over loudspeakers.
You talk about being forced into giving them a federal state. Damn right you're forced. For 25+ years we could neither beat them nor suggest a better option to war. The war's going reasonably well today, so we assume it always will. This war's a long way from being won, so don't lets start counting chicks yet.
Besides, what's wrong with a federal system? What makes you see it as a defeat?
The reason Israel has done so well since independence is mainly support from the US. Monetary and military. And the lack of support for the Palestinians from Arabian nations. The Arabs have been constantly bickering amongst themselves instead of joining toghether against Israel, but like you said, that's really beyond the point.
ReplyDeleteDavid, I agree that there is no way we are going to militarily wipe out the LTTE without significant change outside the battlefield. But that does not mean the political change should come as things stand now, with the LTTE comfortably in control of practically all the north, bar Jaffan.
As things are, the way to go about is to starve them. By Aug 2001, following the long standing embargo on goods to LTTE areas, prices were like 20 times higher than in the south. With the East almost completely under our control, and the navy and intelligence being able to severely limit LTTE shipments, a similar situation can be brought about. And with that will come significant defeats of the LTTE. Not complete victory, but significant enough to push them to the Jungle areas and severely limit their capabilities.
Then we look at the reasons for all this. Following the mismanagement of the economy by the Sirimavo government, unemployment was around 40% amongst the youth. The Sinhalese in the South joined the JVP rebellion to change the government, and the Tamil in the North the independence movement to make their own government. Before that, while the intellectuals were arguing about what the Tamils should get, the ordinary folk wasn't that involved in it.
And you mentioned Canada. They are pretty much the same people, just a difference in the language they speak. Sinhalese and Tamils are completely different, although most outsiders find it hard to see beyond language being the only difference. And I bring my point again, which is Canadians have better things to worry about than picking up weapons and agitating for independence, because the are all well to do.
And what happened with Montenegro? In 1992 they were in a federation with Serbia. They then slowly started cutting off ties with the Serbian government. Soon the independence movement started up (with the backing of foreign countries) and lo and behold they held a referendum in 2006 and people voted for independence. I honestly think that's what we'll end up with if we start giving Tamils self rule today.
And you miss the vital point. Tamils make up just 12-13& of Sri Lanka, and are spread all across the country. Less than half of that live in th north and East. For them to expect a federal state is ridiculous.
Jiff I agree 100%. Federal is just not acceptable. Don't give up hopes yet cos it hasn't happened up to now. My only concern is that MRs leftist inclinations will mean giving into the demands for a federal solution. Its at those times that however much I despise the JHU, I'm kindof glad they are around.
Which brings up what David said
the public cannot be weaned away from the LTTE without a solution to their problems.
My opinion, the solution has to be economic, not political. The day the Tamils are happy with their lives in Sri Lanka is the day they give up hope for independence. The way to achieve that is economic stability, which will only come with the silencing of the LTTE on the battlefield.
And just to emphasize my point, if you give a Tamil the option to pick either a life in a jungle in "Tamil Eelam" or a life living in a nice house in the suburbs of Colombo with a great job and an SUV for transportation what do you think they'll pick? Basic human nature says the latter.
ReplyDelete"The reason Israel has done so well since independence is mainly support from the US. Monetary and military"
ReplyDeleteThe reason Israel has done so well is hard work and willpower, the reason they have survived is because of the US. There's a difference. If they sat baack and complained about the IC they'd have got nowhere. Right now the EU is the biggest financial backer of the Palestinian Authority, so it's not like there's no support. But what's tipped the scales is israel's ability, not its supporters.
"But that does not mean the political change should come as things stand now, with the LTTE comfortably in control of practically all the north"
Political change must be a constant, and not dependent on the fluctuations of the battlefield. Both the miliary option as well as the diplomatic one must be two arms of the same strategy, and neither should influence the other. The right and left arms should be controlled by the brain, in other words, and not controlled by each other. The LTTE is weaker than it has ever been, and there's no time like the present to kick start diplomatic overtures.
"As things are, the way to go about is to starve them."
The thing is to do that you also have to starve the civilian population of the NE, and parents would rather see their kids well fed and in the LTTE than staarving in their homes. It's a short-sighted policy which merely creates the next generation of Tigers.
"With the East almost completely under our control, and the navy and intelligence being able to severely limit LTTE shipments, a similar situation can be brought about. "
I think you're being very optimistic here. I doubt the East will ever be completely under our control. We just don't have the manpower. As soon as the GoSl moves focus to the North, you'll find the East bein infilterated once more. And our int couldn't detect or warn us of the Tiger air threat, so I doubt they could satisfactorily interdict arms supplies.
"And what happened with Montenegro? In 1992 they were in a federation with Serbia. They then slowly started cutting off ties with the Serbian government."
Yes, they were one entity with Serbia, but the constitution of Serbia & Montenegro allowed for an eventual plebiscite in order that either party could opt for independence. It wasn't a case of them gradually cutting ties.
"For them to expect a federal state is ridiculous."
In a perfect world, it would be; but SL isn't, and given the attitude of the Sinhalese establishment, I find it far from ridiculous for the Tamil-speaking population (not just the Tamils) to want a federal state where Tamil is the languaage of administration. The Tamil demands werren't plucked out of Prabha's backside; they aare a direct reaction to years of persecution and injustice.
"And you mentioned Canada. They are pretty much the same people, just a difference in the language they speak. Sinhalese and Tamils are completely different"
Both counts are highly debatable. I've found French Canadians to be as different from English Canadians as the French are from the Americans. Language, culture everything. Whereas my personal view is that the Sinhalese and Tamils are hardly different, more like the serbs & Croats, but with the language issue thrown in.
"Federal is just not acceptable. "
Why not? There are many federal models to choose from (US, Canadian, German, etc). Why is it not acceptable (other than the paaranoia that it would lead to independence, which can be constitutionally prevented)?
"if you give a Tamil the option to pick either a life in a jungle in "Tamil Eelam" or a life living in a nice house in the suburbs of Colombo with a great job and an SUV for transportation what do you think they'll pick"
I agree that the solution must include economic reform; I didn't say it had to be political, I said it had to be diplomatic -- the latter including economy. But the point you are missing is that very few Sinhalese live in the suburbs of Colombo and drive SUVs, so if you want to convince the Tamil man on the street, you have to first show him that you can do what you're promising with your own people first. And the GoSL shows no such ability.
But again, you're asking the wrong questions. What you should be asking the Tamil man is, given that he wants to live in the suburbs and drive an SUV, where does he want that suburb to be -- Colombo, or a Trinco developed enough to be on par with Colombo, Are you sure of the answer now?
Forget the SUVs, machang. Let's see the GoSL provide proper housing, education, and medical care to the Sinhalese population before offering pie in the sky to the Tamils.
Jiffy, if your ONLY reason for disliking federalism is that "it came down to federalism", then that's not an argument. It's like saying, "I dislike solutions because we're forced to come up with a solution". And what do you mean, "it came down to federalism"? It was always about federalism. The Tamils asked for it in the '70s, and we said no. If we'd agreed or explored it, we wouldn't have had to kill and sacrifice thousands. Now, we have a possible solution, but we won't taake it because we've sacrificed thousands? So whaat's the plan? Sacrifice a few more thousand until the next generation is old enough to die in turn?
ReplyDeleteAnd it IS our fathers and forefathers who brought this on us. And every other sonofabitch who voted in bastards like SWRD on a Sinhala-only ticket. Let's at least prove that this generation can learn from history, and not pass on this cluster fuck to our kids.
And in case I wasn't clear, I am all for anhilating the LTTE (like we "anhilated" the JVP). It just won't solve the problem -- because the problem didn't start with the LTTE. So by all means, go for it, but you won't succeed until you can make the Tamil people feel that they're equal citizens in this country (with all the linguistic, cultural, economic, and individual rights) like the majority. If you can give them that and put in place the constitutional guarantees to ensure they'll always have it, they'll abandon the LTTE and we can destroy them at leisure.
"if the tamils had no external backing, this situation would never arise in the first place."
You're wrong there, my friend. There was no external backing in instigating an uprising (just as there was none with the JVP). The Tamils took up arms and India then stepped in to help. The only difference if India hadn't helped, would have been a repeat of the Tibetan revolt against the Chinese, or the two JVP uprisings. The Tamils would've been left to be persecuted for many decades more. It was Sinhalese racism and persecution that created Tamil militancy. The first step down the road to adulthood (for an individual as well as a nation) is to take responsibility for actions taken.
So tell me, what's wrong with devolution?
Just in case I didn't make MYSELF clear, Jiffy, Illegal et al, the war is NOT the problem. The war is a symptom of the problem -- which is an ethnic one. Destroy the LTTE, and you'll soon have them back with a different name. Solve the core problem, and the war will dry up. Take a look at Northern Ireland -- the IRA were never destroyed, but now the Brits don't need to. There's no place for pride in governance (or in war), only wisdom and foresight.
ReplyDelete"you're a tamil sympathiser mate. no hiding it."
ReplyDeleteDamn straight I am, and I don't take it as an insult because I know the difference between a Tamil and a Tiger, which you obviously don't, probably 'cos you've never seen a Tiger except on TV. The only reason I was in the Army was 'cos I grew up in the south. If I'd grown up in the north, I'd have been a Tiger. And I've a lot more sympathy for the Tamils (not the Tigers) than I have for you lot.
" i wonder do your army buddies share these ideas? "
My Army buddies can speak for themselves, but I can tell you that we've got a lot more respect for the Tigers out there in the jungle facing us, than dumbfuck civilians who cheer for more war while sitting on their arses here in Colombo.
" can understand them not wanting to die in a pathetic war that should have been won ages ago. that i understand perfectly. "
That's where you're wrong again. Mate. It doesn't matter whether the war's pathetic or not if you're dead. Death is the same. It's not the movies. And we know it.
"ut i doubt they share your enthusiasm for cutting up sri lanka"
Who said anything about cutting up Sri Lanka? You obviously don't know much about federalism, so I suggest you read up on it before spouting bollocks. Fedaralism (not federation, since you seem to be confused about the two) unites countries. READ some history instead of comic books. Or wait til you study about it for your A/Levels.
"those comrades who've faced the enemy in the eye don't share these types of views. "
Yeah? What "comrades" are those? Mate. You're PS2 buddies who think war's about pushing buttons? "Comrade" my arse. Where were YOU, "comrade", when we were at EPS? I didn't see YOU, "comrade". We're not your comrades. Mate.
"my guess, and it's a damned good one, is that most folks who join the army don't sit on their behinds defending the enemy on a blogsite"
No they don't. Mate. So if you feel you could do a job of it, the Recruiting Centre's in Kohuwela. No big rush though. The kilometre-long queues we stood in for days have disappeared. So stroll in anytime. But I won't hold my breath. If the Sinhalese as a so-called nation fought half as hard as the Tamils have, you'd have won by now.
"there is no love lost between the army and jaffna tamils."
Correction: there's no love lost between the Army and hostile civilians anywhere. The Army will cheerfully axe a bunch of Sinhalese as quick as a bunch of Tamils. As they proved in '87-89. We (Christian & Muslim soldiers) have cleared Buddhist priests off roads in the south with boots and belt buckles, while our Buddhist friends cheered. There was no love lost there either.
"so dont lie through your teeth about military men wanting devolution or being 'behind' tamil claims for autonomy."
Where did I say that? Comrade.
" these same men believe the tamils were mistreated for 30 years like you claim? "
Some do, some don't. Mostly it depends on their age. Those of us born in the '70s know the truth. Most born after '83 know no better.
"soldier, or no soldier you're living in a fairy floss land mate."
So where do you live, Jiffyspaceman, Mars? Mate.
"lastly, do you know why devolution won't become a workable reality...EVER?! because whatever is offered will be too 'weak' for the tamils, and too 'strong' for the sinhalese"
That remains to be seen, but I think I credit the "masses" with a bit more smarts than you.
"i commend your utopian values, but history is on my side. "
Yeah? Which part of history is that, the Mahavamsa? Name me a guerrilla unit with popular support and safe haven that has been defeated by military means in the last 100 years. Mate.
"ps! i dont appreciate being called a "#uckhead""
Maybe you should pull your head out of your arse then.
I've often met soldiers on leave on buses from Kandy-Colombo and their opinions don't mirror your's David. Not the higher ups. I mean regular infantry. Everyone I've spoken to says the same thing - in the finest Sinhalese possible - that what they want is to screw the LTTE as hard as they can. No one wants to die. But 90% of the regular guys in the Army don't want an Eelam either. I voted UNP before I came over here, and ancient deep south rivalry between our families mean I've always hated MRs guts, but I like the way he's dealing with the situation. The guy is almost incompetent at running the country, and the economy will suffer. But he has that manner which can get ordinary folk to listen to him. And patriotically get behind him and the idea of defeating the LTTE. And high morale is half the battle.
ReplyDeleteThe Irish situation is not at all comparable. Ireland was a independent nation that was invaded by the British. They have always had a right to ask the British Army to get the fuck out of their country. Sri Lanka has never really had an independent Tamil nation as such, and Tamils have no right to ask for self-rule.
I lived in Sri Lanka 20 years and now go to school in the US and often cross the border (cos the drinking age is 18) and I've seen both situations first hand. And I can tell you they are nothing alike. I mean I went to private school in Sri Lanka and had Tamils in my A/L classes, but there's always that sense that we are different. Not the case among Canadians. That I can tell you. They call themselves Canadians. French speaking and English speaking. But Canadians. We call ourselves Sinhalese and Tamils. It is completely different.
And the war absolutely is the problem. Yes is was, initially, a symptom of the perceived discrimination and the poverty of the Tamils, but soon it manifested into the actual problem. After the liberalization of the 70s, the economy was looking up. Best growth since independence blah blah and if the war hadn't interrupted things, the situation will have been a lot different. Grated there still will have been Tamils who advocate independence, but nowhere near as many with nothing to loose that would make them want to fight and die for the cause.
I used to hate SWRD and and his policies that screwed the country, but history is not always as clear as it seams on the outside. Looking at it now, if not for him, what would the country be like today? Will 40% of university places be taken by Tamils just because they were willing to bend over backwards to satisfy the British. What would that had led to? Ultimate control over the island for the Tamils? And remember, in 1956 the UNP under Sir John ALSO PROMISED TO BRING SINHALA ONLY policies if elected.
"where does he want that suburb to be -- Colombo, or a Trinco developed enough to be on par with Colombo, Are you sure of the answer now?
Where will he prefer that suburb? No question in a Tamil Homland somewhere. But then will he rather look like an ordinary dark skinned Tamil or a handsome white guy with actor type good looks? No question the latter. But like you said this isn't the perfect world. They will be realistic looking at what they have to gain and most importantly what they have to loose in asking for independence. For the Tamil youth of the 70s, they had nothing to loose. No jobs, no hope, no future. But our SUV driving friend has way too much to loose to drop everything and take up arms.
"It's a short-sighted policy which merely creates the next generation of Tigers.
There won't be a next generation if we play our cards right. Cut off from their arms and supplies, they will become a lot easier to take out. Jayasikuru took so much LTTE territory, but the guys in charge grew way too overconfident and spread the troops way too thin. Poor poor planing. Its not like we couldn't have launched an offensive to take Thoppigala in January itself. Instead current policies seem to actually understand how best to deal with the LTTE. Starve them, strangle them and hit them hard only where they're weak.
"I doubt the East will ever be completely under our control.
Yes it will, because the LTTE are being truly kicked out this time. Not like the half hearted policies of the past, where they were always in control of the jungle areas. And this time, like in Vakarai, development will result in the people drifting away from the LTTE.
"And our int couldn't detect or warn us of the Tiger air threat, so I doubt they could satisfactorily interdict arms supplies.
3 ships were sunks in less than a month due to intelligence reports. Some will get through, but with the new military hardware we're getting, its becomming increasingly difficult for them to continue their smuggling.
"Forget the SUVs, machang. Let's see the GoSL provide proper housing, education, and medical care to the Sinhalese population before offering pie in the sky to the Tamils.
And where does the money come from? As long as the LTTE is a capable fighting force we will never have stability and never have stable economic growth. If we do give them Federal, will they ever disarm their cadres? Will they allow a Sinhalese army "occupy" their newly won "state"? No way.
"Why is it not acceptable (other than the paaranoia that it would lead to independence, which can be constitutionally prevented)?
This is probably the MOST IMPORTANT point. Jiff hit the nail on the head and David I'm sure you understand this. Whatever devolution is offered to the Tamils, it will NEVER be good enough.
Can independence be constitutionally prevented? So are you saying the civil war is allowed by the constitution? That the bombing of the bus yesterday was legal according to the constitution? Laws mean nothing during times like that. What if the leaders of the Tamil "State" say they want independence? What are we going to do? Launch another war to stop them? To stop a now well organized entity which they have never been before? Descend back into all of this but 10 times worse?
Destroy the LTTE today, no, more like corner them and cut off their balls today, and bring rapid development to the Tamil areas, and I guarantee there will be no further uprisings. Make a situation like is now between the blacks and Caucasians in the US, where you have a black dude with a serious chance for the White House and you're not going to see further uprisings. A Tamil as president may seem unimaginable to most Sinhalese (including me, who has never known anything other than war with the Tamils), but 30 years of peace and development could do strange things.
David, ultimately you overestimate human nature. It all boils down to the basic life of the people. If the government is mismanaging the economy, what can you do about it? how can you vent your anger? For the Tamils, the answer came in the form of this independence movement.
Pacify them with the various carrots brought upon by economic development and they will no longer see a need to fight for independence. And again, the only way we are doing that is severely weakening the LTTE on the battlefield first.
Interesting discussion. Keep it up.
ReplyDeleteWe think it is time to correct one statement here (not the political viewpoints).
""
The kilometre-long queues we stood in for days have disappeared. ""
Special Forces HQ in Seeduwa had some pretty long queues in the recent past. Overall, army recruitment rate has gone up, not down.
No patriot who joined the army would agree to the concept of Eelam. Even if the LTTE agrees for a feasible solution in peace talks, they can never be trusted. We've had experience of 3 failed peace talks which the tigers used merely for buying time. (If anyone was wondering, we too are part of the army; Which Division or batallion is open for your speculation)
We agree that minorities were discriminated in the past. But this trends is almost non existent in modern times (Abductions will be an invalid argument here as the one who were abducted are LTTE intelligence wing members).
No one here's suggested Eelam, Defencenet.
ReplyDeleteI've seen the queues at Seeduwa. I believe there are a thousand metres in a kilometre, not three hundred (whatever battalion you're in!) :)
And recruitment maybe up over last year or even the one before, but it nowhere compares to the recruitment level of the early '90s. Let's try not to believe our own propoganda.
"Everyone I've spoken to says the same thing - in the finest Sinhalese possible - that what they want is to screw the LTTE as hard as they can. "
ReplyDeleteSo do I, Illegal. But there's a difference between screwing the Tigers and screwing the Tamils.
"ut 90% of the regular guys in the Army don't want an Eelam either."
And neither do I. Are you telling me that you're unable to distinguish between a federal system and an independent state? I am aware that the majority of the country doesn't know the difference (mostly because no one's bothered to explain, but sou claaim to be US-educated, so I bet you can tell that there no such thing as the Republic of California.
"The Irish situation is not at all comparable."
I didn't compare it, Illegal. DO wish you'd read before replying. Might save us both time. I pointed out the fact thaat the brits resolved the ssituaation by removing the Provos need to take up arms. AND without having to withdraw from NI.
"And I can tell you they are nothing alike"
Again, never said they were. What I did say was that the Quebecois are as different from the English-speaking Canadians as the French are from Americans (and yes, I've been to Quebec), and that if a two-laanguage federal system could work for two such diverse cultures, there's no reason why it shouldn't be explored here. No one's saying we should transplant thaat system here; but that it's worth taking a look at while we're chucking bullets at each other.
"best growth since independence blah blah and if the war hadn't interrupted things, the situation will have been a lot different. "
Ha ha. Let me get this straight. You're saying that the war interrupted the improving conditions of the Tamils? OK, I must admit I've not heard that one before. Maybe not having been born at the time has given you special insight. Has it occured to you that the Tamils might haave gone to war becaause they didn't have much else of a choice?
"Looking at it now, if not for him, what would the country be like today? Will 40% of university places be taken by Tamils just because they were willing to bend over backwards to satisfy the British. "
I don't know about the 40% but I do know thaat we wouldn't have 80% of our graduaates unemployed because they don't speak English or didn't go to St Thomas'. Did that escape you while you were studying in the US and at your private Colombo school? What SWRD did was instead of building up the education of the Sinhaalese, he decided to make the education useless to everyone but the Sinhalese elite.
"Where will he prefer that suburb? No question in a Tamil Homland somewhere. But then will he rather look like an ordinary dark skinned Tamil or a handsome white guy with actor type good looks"
Maybe that's what you're looking for over in the US, Illegal, but it's hardly the point is it? The point is you can't offer the Tamils something that you can't even offer your own masses.
"because the LTTE are being truly kicked out this time"
I've heard that so many times since '90 it's not even funny anymore. The East has NEVER been totally secure. but again, it's all beside the point, and thaat is that you need more than just aa miltary approach.
"And this time, like in Vakarai, development will result in the people drifting away from the LTTE."
I didn't know that MBRL fire was termed "development" these days, becaaue it was arty that got the Tamil civilians out of the area and away from the Tigers. Have you even been to the East recently, Illegal?
":And where does the money come from? As long as the LTTE is a capable fighting force we will never have stability and never have stable economic growth."
Sure the LTTE is contributing to the country's economic instability, but a great factor is also the rampant corruption, with every single politician and civil servant lining his pocket. If some high ranker waasn't taking a cut on every chopper and tank we buy, we'd have money to fight the war aand be economically more stable. In the first years of the CFA, the country was at relaative peace, but was there any significant improvement to the lives of the rural masses? The excuse of waar is getting old, my friend, though not so old I guess for a 20-year-old.
"Whatever devolution is offered to the Tamils, it will NEVER be good enough."
Well, you'll never know til you try. The point is to decimate the LTTE while offering the Tamils what they want. Unless of course you agree with the LTTE that they are the sole representatives of the Tamils and that they speak for them. Do you think that way, Illegal? Because you seem unable to deferentiate between what the LTTE says and what the Tamils want.
"Can independence be constitutionally prevented? So are you saying the civil war is allowed by the constitution"
Legal separation can be prevented if failsafes are written into the constitution. Any UDI then is illegal, and the GoSL would be justified in the eyes of the IC in going to war to prevent it, as long as the central government hasn't instigated that UDI by uinconstitutional means. No, the suicide bombings are not constitutional, but neither was '83, or the 25 years of persecution the Tamils underwent. If Texas was to UDI, the US would be justified in putting it down.
"Destroy the LTTE today, no, more like corner them and cut off their balls today, and bring rapid development to the Tamil areas, and I guarantee there will be no further uprisings"
I'm sure things look quite black & white when you're 20 years old and in the US, but I'm afraid it's not quite so clear cut over here. Just last week I was having a similar chat witha Tiger-supporter (alao from the US like you) on www.indi.ca who thinks Prabha is doing a "damn fine job"!
"Make a situation like is now between the blacks and Caucasians in the US, where you have a black dude with a serious chance for the White House and you're not going to see further uprisings."
Undoubtedly. But I see no such signs of such proposals from the GoSL.
"A Tamil as president may seem unimaginable to most Sinhalese"
It's not only unimaginable, Illegal, it's impossible. Haven't you read the constitution? The president has to swear an oath to protect Buddhism. That basically rules out Christians, Muslims, and Hindus as head of state.
"If the government is mismanaging the economy, what can you do about it? how can you vent your anger? For the Tamils, the answer came in the form of this independence movement."
Don't be foolish. Tamil militancy had nothing to do with mismaanagement of the economy. It waas about one ethnic group being treated as lesser citizens.
"Pacify them with the various carrots brought upon by economic development and they will no longer see a need to fight for independence."
But where are the carrots? They've all gone into "helping Hambantota". You can't waait for the LTTE to be defeated. Even the most optimistic predictions (Gotabaya's) says three years. The EU and the IC are not gonna wait that long. Both prongs of the fork have to go in simultaneously. You can't deeat the Tigers without the Tamils, and you can't win over the Tamils by just focusing on the Tigers. You have to be able to keep both baalls in the air at the same time.
Jiffy, it is flawed logic to say "We have sacrificed the lives of thousands, so let's honour that sacrifice by sacrificing thousands more", because we're too proud to be realistic. I also find it distasteful coming from someone who hasn't (and most likely never will) make that sacrifice himself.
ReplyDeleteThe thousands of servicemen who sacrificed their lives did NOT do it to prevent devolution, they did it to prevent separation. What cheapens their sacrifice is our inability to find aa solution that doesn't involve sacrificing thousands more. Federalism isn't separatism. The faster you understand what federalism is, the easier it'll be to have an adult discussion with you. I've explained how federalism is different from separation, but since you are unable to respond to that you're falling back on the convenient JVP/JHU bogey of crying wolf and suggesting that federalism equals separatism. Federalism provides a way for SL to retain its unitary integrity, which you say is what the Sinhalese have "fought" for since independence.
Not sure what you mean when you say you wonder what the soldiers' legacy will be. Soldiers are a tool of the state. Their legacy is that of the state.
And to say the Sinhalese masses are against federalism or were for the removal of the IPKF is rubbish. They are led by their leaders. In the late '80s they followed Premadasa's rhetoric on kicking out the foreigners. I'm sure they wouldn't have been so pliable if they knew he was funding and arming the Tigers. Maybe he considered the LTTE Sri Lankans! No national leader has taken the trouble to explain federalism, and in fact many have done their best to deceive the people on the subject.
"i think it is very naive to expect a federal solution to compensate for the hurts of many generations."
But no one's suggesting that this is compensation. Whatever gave you that idea? No solution can compensate, but it can be the framework within which the aspirations of all Sri Lankans can be met.
David… Good on you… I totally agree and back what you say 100%... You know, India is a majority Hindu country but their president comes from their biggest minority the Muslims who are only 13.5% of the population. Their prime minister is from the Sikh minority who are only 1.9% of the population. The problem in Sri Lanka is that most Sinhalese Buddhists believe that one has to be a Sinhalese Buddhist to have the best interest of the country at heart.
ReplyDeleteJiffy… your comment “you're a tamil sympathiser mate. no hiding it. just stop with the yap yap and just say it outright” just goes to show how narrow minded people can be and why we are in this situation we are in at present.
Thanks, YZ.
ReplyDelete"what an utterly transparent and redundant personal attack!"
What's the matter, "comrade", can't take the flak for your statements? You, who have never seen war, who will never see war (if you're lucky), who live because better men than you stand on the wall to keep the Tigers back, calls for more war and for the death and mutilation of those men? Of course it's personal. You're asking for others to sacrifice themselves for your arrogant pigheadedness. It's like a virgin talking about sex. Grow up, "mate", war's not very nice, so if you want more of it, at least put your balls where your tongue is and join up. If you get through the training intact, you'll have your chance to preserve the unity of this country yourself instead of demanding others do it for you.
"soldiers must follow the state. so do what your govt tells you- do what the sri lankan people expect you to do."
Oh they will, and they're not waiting for you to tell 'em. You are neither the government, nor the people, just one individual wanna be who's watched too many war movies.
"if they agree with your point of view then so be it. but the fact is david the vast majority dont."
So now you're the spokesperson for the majority too?
david blacker,
ReplyDeleteI think that you should take the long political discussions elsewhere like Lanka Academic or Lankanewspapers. Lanka Academic is a better place to do a sane discussion.
Sam, it's not a political debate. It's about whether you win or lose, and what the definition of that is. And it's not that they're saner over on other blogs; just older and more experienced.
ReplyDeleteJiffy, what would you like me to learn? That devolution has to be offered? That's what I've been saying for the last few days. Did you miss that?
We can leave out the long intellectual debates and go back to being experts (thanks to Jane's) on bombs and jets if you like. But you can't win a war with bombs and jets, as the US is learning once again.
ok guys,
ReplyDeletelets get back to some defense stuff, and to all the systems and how to set about them...please...
:-)
Thanks